Comments on: India Nuclear Deal Math https://totalwonkerr.net/2006/04/14/india-math/ Thu, 04 May 2006 01:56:02 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=7.0 By: Sampathkumar Iyangar https://totalwonkerr.net/2006/04/14/india-math/#comment-123 Thu, 04 May 2006 01:56:02 +0000 http://www.totalwonkerr.net/india-math/#comment-123 Mr Amit Joshi:
It is one thing to conduct trials & tests according to carefully designed protocols or facing an accident despite having taken utmost care of safety. It is entirely another thing to let a Mafia siphon off huge funds behind a thick veil of secrecy for erecting nuclear facilities that employ look-alike imitations. Thirst for a sense of euphoria must not blind a country to wink at shenanigans while handling the inherently dangerous technology.

]]> By: Amit Joshi https://totalwonkerr.net/2006/04/14/india-math/#comment-122 Sat, 29 Apr 2006 02:10:25 +0000 http://www.totalwonkerr.net/india-math/#comment-122 “More serious than the heist, taking liberties with nuclear safety constitutes a graver danger to the whole planet.”

What kind of illogic is this? After plenty of atmospheric tests and a nuclear accident at Chernobyl, the rest of the world is doing fine, thank you very much.

]]> By: Sampathkumar Iyangar https://totalwonkerr.net/2006/04/14/india-math/#comment-121 Fri, 28 Apr 2006 02:14:10 +0000 http://www.totalwonkerr.net/india-math/#comment-121 s Union for Civil Liberties (PUCL) against a High Court’s refusal to issue a directive to the government to disclose the contents of a report of the Atomic Energy Regulation Board (AERB). The main author of the report (prepared 8 years previously), former AERB chairman A Gopalakrishnan was also a petitioner. He contended that “serious nuclear accidents" could take place at Narora and Kaiga as well as in other facilities because of cover-ups. PUCL had submitted, “Safety violations and defects in nuclear installations and power plants across the country are alarming as nuclear degradation is feared" and “citizens should have access to the report" to know about the danger. The court upheld attorney general Soli Sorabjee’s contention that the AERB report would reveal to “enemies" data containing “inventories, spent fuel, waste, etc, facilitating the calculation of the country’s nuclear programme potential". The judges agreed that the “right to information is a fundamental right" and “horror of nuclear holocaust was taught to the human race when the American bomber, Enola Gay, from the clouds emptied its bowels on Hiroshima," but the Chief Justice added, “in a civil democratic society, every right is a regulated right" and denied access to the AERB report. Under this situation, nukes with Iran’s Mullahs and North Korea’s junta should be much more safe! My information is that the former conscientious AERB Chief has since been brought around. <br /> 2. Maturity Level: Mature people realize that “peaceful atomic implosion" is an oxymoron and cannot be considered as “impeccable nonproliferation record". Also, the “maturity" shows in President Musharaf’s public warning, “Our response shall be swift and massive if provoked" just before neighbor Pakistan conducted retaliatory nuke test blast in June 1998, which a “mature" politician (who was beaten to the post of Prime Minister and who may well become PM next year!) in the New Delhi dispensation attempted to preempt.<br /> 3. Budget utilization: The ONLY publicized review of the budget utilization of DAE was in 1994-95 report #17 by the Parliamentary joint standing committee on energy, headed by the then opposition MP Captain Jaswant Singh. It revealed that the state-owned monopoly nuclear power utility Nuclear Power Corporation showed a dud inventory of unused and obsolete equipment worth Rs 1300 crore ($320 M, more than a whole year’s budget allocation those days), half of which constituted warehousing and interest costs. The nuclear cabal saw to it that such “matters of national interest" did not get published in future! This gentleman Jaswant Singh eventually became defense and foreign minister in the next government that ended India’s virtual, 24-year, testing moratorium to perpetrate pariah status internationally that benefits no one but the nuclear cabal. <br /> TALK IS CHEAP. Unfortunately, that’s exactly what the semi-literate, college-educated “intelligentsia" of India does not realize. Thirst for a sense of euphoria blinds them of the enormous cost – certainly not affordable by the Fourth World nation – which it costs to the half-starving population. The weapons program, pursued by the Mafia to divert attention off nonperformance and shenanigans of the nuclear establishment, like the power program, employs look-alike imitations for handling the inherently dangerous technology. More serious than the heist, taking liberties with nuclear safety constitutes a graver danger to the whole planet.]]> Manne (and RT)
1. Transparency: The diabolic nexus between the organs of the state including judiciary in India and the cabal of nuclear “experts” is brought out in a news item in The Telegraph on January 6, 2004
Extracts: The Supreme Court dismissed an appeal by People’s Union for Civil Liberties (PUCL) against a High Court’s refusal to issue a directive to the government to disclose the contents of a report of the Atomic Energy Regulation Board (AERB). The main author of the report (prepared 8 years previously), former AERB chairman A Gopalakrishnan was also a petitioner. He contended that “serious nuclear accidents” could take place at Narora and Kaiga as well as in other facilities because of cover-ups. PUCL had submitted, “Safety violations and defects in nuclear installations and power plants across the country are alarming as nuclear degradation is feared” and “citizens should have access to the report” to know about the danger. The court upheld attorney general Soli Sorabjee’s contention that the AERB report would reveal to “enemies” data containing “inventories, spent fuel, waste, etc, facilitating the calculation of the country’s nuclear programme potential”. The judges agreed that the “right to information is a fundamental right” and “horror of nuclear holocaust was taught to the human race when the American bomber, Enola Gay, from the clouds emptied its bowels on Hiroshima,” but the Chief Justice added, “in a civil democratic society, every right is a regulated right” and denied access to the AERB report. Under this situation, nukes with Iran’s Mullahs and North Korea’s junta should be much more safe! My information is that the former conscientious AERB Chief has since been brought around.
2. Maturity Level: Mature people realize that “peaceful atomic implosion” is an oxymoron and cannot be considered as “impeccable nonproliferation record”. Also, the “maturity” shows in President Musharaf’s public warning, “Our response shall be swift and massive if provoked” just before neighbor Pakistan conducted retaliatory nuke test blast in June 1998, which a “mature” politician (who was beaten to the post of Prime Minister and who may well become PM next year!) in the New Delhi dispensation attempted to preempt.
3. Budget utilization: The ONLY publicized review of the budget utilization of DAE was in 1994-95 report #17 by the Parliamentary joint standing committee on energy, headed by the then opposition MP Captain Jaswant Singh. It revealed that the state-owned monopoly nuclear power utility Nuclear Power Corporation showed a dud inventory of unused and obsolete equipment worth Rs 1300 crore ($320 M, more than a whole year’s budget allocation those days), half of which constituted warehousing and interest costs. The nuclear cabal saw to it that such “matters of national interest” did not get published in future! This gentleman Jaswant Singh eventually became defense and foreign minister in the next government that ended India’s virtual, 24-year, testing moratorium to perpetrate pariah status internationally that benefits no one but the nuclear cabal.
TALK IS CHEAP. Unfortunately, that’s exactly what the semi-literate, college-educated “intelligentsia” of India does not realize. Thirst for a sense of euphoria blinds them of the enormous cost – certainly not affordable by the Fourth World nation – which it costs to the half-starving population. The weapons program, pursued by the Mafia to divert attention off nonperformance and shenanigans of the nuclear establishment, like the power program, employs look-alike imitations for handling the inherently dangerous technology. More serious than the heist, taking liberties with nuclear safety constitutes a graver danger to the whole planet.

]]> By: Prashant R. Dahat https://totalwonkerr.net/2006/04/14/india-math/#comment-120 Tue, 25 Apr 2006 22:12:05 +0000 http://www.totalwonkerr.net/india-math/#comment-120 It is a glorious to me for research on this perticular matter, for that please send me some historical and prospective data on it.

]]> By: Manne https://totalwonkerr.net/2006/04/14/india-math/#comment-119 Thu, 20 Apr 2006 17:50:28 +0000 http://www.totalwonkerr.net/india-math/#comment-119 Sampathkumar Iyangar,

We would really be interested in reading your essays but care to substantiate all the allegations you have made so far?

For example,
– are you sure no mechanism exists for review of budget utilisation by DAE and its arms?
– what does maturity level of other nations in the region have to do with India’s civilian programme?
– what sort of tranparency are you talking about? Surely you wouldn’t want their design data to be posted on the net now, would you?

Talk is cheap.

]]> By: Manne https://totalwonkerr.net/2006/04/14/india-math/#comment-118 Thu, 20 Apr 2006 17:44:12 +0000 http://www.totalwonkerr.net/india-math/#comment-118 re a bunch of idiots.” which I will not particularly challenge but then we have “Do I really need to explain what happens to that percentage if and when India builds more military facilities?”<br /> <br /> A-ha! Yes, I think you do need to explain that. And while you are at it, please also explain what civilian capacity India is interested in putting up (MWe will do nicely) and what happens to the percentage then unless you are bright enough to imply that construction of mil reactors of that order of MWe rating is plausible in the India scenario (remember, the need for the deal is limited Uranium!).<br /> <br /> On the other hand, if you just count the reactors and not take their MWe rating into account I will ask you to explain the basis for finding a 40MWe mil reactor comparable to a 1000 MWe civilian reactor.<br /> <br /> See what I mean? I really don’t have to try hard when asking such questions.<br /> <br /> Cheers!]]> Paul,

Given that you haven’t been able to answer questions I have posed so far, I am not very hopeful of you answering this one but on the other hand I am the eternal optimist….

So, you say “Yeah, obviously we’re a bunch of idiots.” which I will not particularly challenge but then we have “Do I really need to explain what happens to that percentage if and when India builds more military facilities?”

A-ha! Yes, I think you do need to explain that. And while you are at it, please also explain what civilian capacity India is interested in putting up (MWe will do nicely) and what happens to the percentage then unless you are bright enough to imply that construction of mil reactors of that order of MWe rating is plausible in the India scenario (remember, the need for the deal is limited Uranium!).

On the other hand, if you just count the reactors and not take their MWe rating into account I will ask you to explain the basis for finding a 40MWe mil reactor comparable to a 1000 MWe civilian reactor.

See what I mean? I really don’t have to try hard when asking such questions.

Cheers!

]]> By: RT https://totalwonkerr.net/2006/04/14/india-math/#comment-117 Tue, 18 Apr 2006 10:24:29 +0000 http://www.totalwonkerr.net/india-math/#comment-117 Mr. Iyangar

The US nuclear program too is run by secretive bureaucrats. The Pentagon, the NRC etc are super secretive. No one is more secretive than China is. If you catch my drift, you’ll see that all nuclear bureaucracies tend to be secretive and possessive. The “maturity levels” of Indians is just as high or as low as anyone else. If all these nations can collaborate on nuclear matters, so can India – regardless of what some washed up wannabe scientist says.

]]> By: Sampathkumar Iyangar https://totalwonkerr.net/2006/04/14/india-math/#comment-116 Tue, 18 Apr 2006 02:12:07 +0000 http://www.totalwonkerr.net/india-math/#comment-116 I have just said: Until the nuclear science establishment is purged of fake scientists serving narrow vested interests of the Mafiaso consisting of corrupt bureaucrats and slimy politicians of all shades including Communists and religious fundamentalists and until full transparency is ensured, any international technological cooperation will only be at a grave risk to the entire planet, given the maturity level of the nations in the region.

]]> By: RT https://totalwonkerr.net/2006/04/14/india-math/#comment-115 Mon, 17 Apr 2006 09:52:50 +0000 http://www.totalwonkerr.net/india-math/#comment-115 Mr.Iyengar – Do you want to say something?

]]> By: Sampathkumar Iyangar https://totalwonkerr.net/2006/04/14/india-math/#comment-114 Mon, 17 Apr 2006 02:35:03 +0000 http://www.totalwonkerr.net/india-math/#comment-114 Only gullible Indians obsessed with “feel-good” syndrome would buy the “impeccable nonproliferation record” lie of Machiavellian pundits of New Delhi. No amount of hard sell can ever succeed if you want to sell a fundamentally flawed position. The real position is India’s Department of Atomic Energy, which holds the monopoly to everything nuclear by virtue of Atomic Energy Act, is in the clutches of a powerful Mafia that has been thriving under Kafkasque secretiveness ever since the program was hijacked in the 1970s by Indira Gandhi for becoming a Durga (Hindu goddess of power). Proliferation misadventures engineered by nuclear czars in 1974 and 1998, which made India a rogue state, were to gain a sacred cow status for DAE so that they can enjoy nonaccountability in the guise of “national strategic interests”. The Mafia enjoys the blessings of corrupt bureaucrats, scientists, and slimy politicians of all shades including Communists and religious fundamentalists. DAE is beyond scrutiny by judiciary, media, statutory audit, and even Parliament. Corruption abounds and safety is compromised with abandon. Until DAE is purged of fake scientists serving narrow vested interests of this Mafiaso and full transparency is ensured, any international technological cooperation will only be at a grave risk to the entire planet, given the maturity level of the nations in the region.

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